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Nah, of course you don't have to do your homework......

 
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area51newmexico
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 11:27 am    Post subject: Nah, of course you don't have to do your homework...... Reply with quote

Quote:
Usually it is the children, not the parents, who are loath to spend their evenings practising spelling and learning times tables. But a Canadian couple have just won a legal battle to exempt their offspring from homework after successfully arguing there is no clear evidence it improves academic performance.

Shelli and Tom Milley, two lawyers from Calgary, Alberta, launched their highly unusual case after years of struggling to make their three reluctant children do school work out of the classroom.


Oh dear god!

Sounds to me that the parents couldn't be bothered to argue with the kids to get them to do their home work......

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/nov/18/canada-homework-milley

Any thoughts? Is homework good for kids? Or were the parents right?
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I recall people who didn't do their homework failed tests, or did very poorly on them. I know when I did homework the easier the homework became the better I did on tests.

Haven't read your article, I always dread having to wade through moronic reason. Do they give the specifics of their argument? If they do I'll try to read them. If not, I'm depressed enough.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very Happy - I saw this article as well, you've beaten me to it though in posting it.



When I was at school, one of the things I always had trouble with was maths. Anything to do with words, language, reading etc I flew through, I just struggled with maths.

When we had to do group reading ( the class read a book, and everyone took it in turns to read so many pages ) I flew through my reading section but I became frustrated when the person next to me had trouble with certain words and their reading was very stunted, I would actually prompt them what certain words were just so they could hurry up ( we all had to read the book while it was being read out to us and I wanted to just get on with it, I was an impatient child who always wanted to explore the next big thing. It hadn't dawned on me yet, that everyone had their strengths and weaknesses, my weakness being maths )

Also at the end of the week we used to get spelling tests, at 7 years old I was having to learn how to spell words such as Mediterranean ( I kid you not ) I can't spell that word properly now! ( spellcheck to the rescue )
'Punishment' for getting something wrong as homework was to write it out repetitively 20 times because then you would know how to spell it ( went the reasoning )
Oh yeah, I still can't spell Mediterranean ( thank you spell check ).


Now skip forward a few years to a conversation I was having with a friend who we'll call Holly ( it's getting near Christmas after all )


Holly : I was this close last night to bringing work home with me, Steven ( her boss ) keeps pointing out to me how he takes work home, i'm already working 7 till 7 ( her normal working hours are 830-500).

Me : The moment you take work home it will always be expected. Why are you commuting to work then if you're working at home as well? - why not just work from home? You don't go to work to work, then come home to work. You need to switch off sometimes and do other things, this isn't healthy what you're going to end up doing.

At school I think not having homework was the exception not the rule ( was where I was ) you went to school 5 days a week monday - Friday, and each lesson you got homework to be handed in next week, next day it was the same.
At your place of work, the same thing happens, you're given homework...

You need downtime, just trying to force things in constantly is perhaps not going to be totally beneficial. All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy and all that.

What is the purpose of homework? - why does it want to creep into your free time?
Not all ideas that schools come up with have any logical relevance. We had to ask to go to the toilet, and had to be given permission to go.

In secondary school we had a test on something or other and we were warned anything less than 75% was an automatic detention because you'd obviously not done any homework on it.
My friend and I spent the next week doing what we should of been doing in our free time, namely having fun. Test came up and we got 75-80% marks. His stepsister though, who had been 'good' and had done her homework didn't make the 75% grade and got detention for doing her homework... Sorry! for obviously not doing her homework.

Asking for coursework is perhaps different, as you put into practice all you've learnt. But setting homework because you can strikes me as being pointless.

The article wrote:

But a Canadian couple have just won a legal battle to exempt their offspring from homework after successfully arguing there is no clear evidence it improves academic performance.


They have proved to a court then ( not just said 'you don't have to ) they have actually found proof it doesn't work in a 'help you learn' way? - as opposed to a 'please prove that you have learnt'? - impressive Smile

Quote:

Two years ago, Shelli began collecting studies on homework, most of which suggest that, particularly for younger grades, there is no clear link between work at home and school performance. Working with the staff at St Brigid Elementary Junior High School, she formed a homework committee. When no firm changes resulted from the committee, the couple began negotiating the legal document that decided the matter.

"We think it's a parent's right to choose what's in our children's best interests," said Shelli. "But we're thankful the school did the right thing."


Another very strong point I think they made

Quote:

They are tired. They shouldn't be working a second shift."

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area51newmexico
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 12:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aalpha wrote:
Haven't read your article, I always dread having to wade through moronic reason. Do they give the specifics of their argument? If they do I'll try to read them. If not, I'm depressed enough.


Long story short, they say that there is no conclusive evidence to prove that homework boost grades. And something about trying to make their kids do the homework was really stressful so they took they route instead.

minty wrote:
What is the purpose of homework?


I guess because there isn't enough time in class to cover everything needed. Usually, we learnt the topic, the facts and the homework was to write up an essay on the topic. There wouldn't be time to do that in class.

Homework also teaches independence, working at your own pace, organising yourself and under your own motivation. Many jobs, mine included, you're left to your own devices to manage your time and workload. Running your own business would be similar.

Besides which, kids spend a lot less time at school than they would at work (it's about 25hrs a week compared to 40+hrs at work) an hour's homework isn't gonna hurt and will get them used to the year world.

Are you doing homework in your new night class?

minty wrote:
In secondary school we had a test on something or other and we were warned anything less than 75% was an automatic detention because you'd obviously not done any homework on it.
My friend and I spent the next week doing what we should of been doing in our free time, namely having fun. Test came up and we got 75-80% marks. His stepsister though, who had been 'good' and had done her homework didn't make the 75% grade and got detention for doing her homework... Sorry! for obviously not doing her homework.


Ouch! That's a bit harsh! What if the student wasn't very good at that particular subject?

I was the opposite to you in school, I was great at maths and science but really rubbish at English.

*reads the meaning behind Minty's post*
minty - are you for and against homework?

What worries me is the kids will now think that if they (or their parents) kick up enough fuss, they don't have to do what they don't want. "I want X toy for Christmas, I'll throw a tantrum and I'll get it" "I don't want to work for a living, so I'll stamp my feet and I wont have to"
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

area51newmexico wrote:

Are you doing homework in your new night class?


No, essays are set which are for marking which leads to some sort of accreditation or something, but homework isn't set to go over what we did.

Cheese salad Deli wrote:

Ouch! That's a bit harsh! What if the student wasn't very good at that particular subject?


Homework wouldn't of helped ? - I remember her almost being in tears saying such things like 'that's not fair' and 'I did my homework' - my mate and me decided to get out of class at the end sharpish before she complained to the teacher and get us to stay behind or something.

Cheese and tomato Deli wrote:

*reads the meaning behind Minty's post*
minty - are you for and against homework?


I don't mind homework being set when there is some point to it. Setting it just for the hell of it ( which I used to think some teachers would do some of the time ) strikes me as being a bit pointless.

Prawn pasta Deli wrote:

What worries me is the kids will now think that if they (or their parents) kick up enough fuss, they don't have to do what they don't want. "I want X toy for Christmas, I'll throw a tantrum and I'll get it" "I don't want to work for a living, so I'll stamp my feet and I wont have to"


We can only hope that parents the world over recognise limits of things like this and set appropriate boundaries. Turning out spoilt children is not something to be proud of.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think some courses at an appropriate level can be completed without homework uh, shall we say out of class work. But for the most part those would be refresher or enhancement topics for people in a career.

Children who are being taught the basics and all that is built on the basics including University level work can best be done with out of class assignments. IMHO

It's a bit too simplistic to think of academics as "shift work." I would submit that schools where children are young enough to cry about it are doing something wrong if out of class work is not showing positive results.

They either don't assign the right assignments or they don't use their time well during school hours. That's the teachers/admins I'm talking about not the kids.

I submit there is an abundance of evidence that out of class assignments boosts grades. Schools didn't *start* giving students homework out of pure meanness. There was a demonstrable good reason for it. Kids learned what they were suppose to learn.

I'd be very interested to interview Shelli and Tom Milley's former classmates and find out just what role homework played for them. They sound like lazy parents to me.
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